I don't really know much about this but apparently Messi abused the linesman and has been banned for 4 games. That would mean that Messi is virtually out of the World Cup Qualifiers. Think this is too harsh since FIFA usually does 4 match bans in cases of violence. And this being told the players and team hours before their match is a bit slow on FIFA's part.

That didn't really help them, Messi unable to win for Argentina and the rest waiting for him to copy-paste Maradona won't happen since Maradona is unique, even english players consider him the best of all time which shows alot.

Argentina needs a strong old school coach like Simeone to wake up the whole team.

Go watch Messi games first, How many do you watch a season. If Messi needs 3 or 4 players to be neutralized, thats 4 players less for his teammates to worry about, therefore his impact is further than just scoring goals or creating chances or dribling past 4 players, or through passes between the lines, his only presence on the pitch is significant for opponents, last player to get that much of attention was phenomeno at Inter Milan before injury, their potential is that huge that teams anticipate any lost ball and cover their space even while attacking.
Start watching him play consistently then we will talk.

I've never seen 3 players marking Messi in a consistent manner all game, in the 50 or so games I've seen with him. Ever.

If your refutation is - nice numbers that prove something different, just watch him more and you'll understand - that is the argument of every idiotic fanboy under the sun. I can't even argue with it because you're giving me nothing to work with. It's just a dumb statement.

@sunflash you're joking right. There's always at least 2 people on messi all the time, or watching him. once he touches the ball there's a swarm of 3 - 4 players on him. obviously they can't consistently mark him the whole game...that'd be stupid, they need to play football as well. the point is, they're eyeing him, and those few seconds or minutes they're eyeing him, is a few minutes for neymar, suarez, or anyone else on the team to create play. for argentina, there's always people on him. against chile 3 players were on him all the time. the only time they weren't was when chile was on the counter attack.

Maybe there are things in life you don't see, maybe it's one of them.

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Messi had nobody guarding him when he missed the first penalty for Argentina.

Maybe pictures are better than words in this case...

I can post 3000 pics like this, but you can do better go watch analyses videos about how Messi marking operate...

Even when he hasn't the ball he is marked by man marking plus zonal marking, when he starts taking speed from 2 marking opponents it can go to 3 4 5 6 until he looses the ball, if he looses it....

Just to make it clear, there are many things I ignore or misunderstand, but it's not one of them.

I can give you coaches who face him and adapt tactics to him, Legend of the game, Sampaoli, Mourinho, Pep...

For me the idiot is the one who can't see further than stats, marked by 5 players whole game, thats idiotic too. I think you learn tactics in North America and have good coaches, since you are a defender what kind of marking did your coach learned you ?

Have you ever faced such a pacey dribbler than intelligently anticipated he will dribble your teammate and anticipated the space behind him to close him the door ? Robben for instance when trying to do his special with his left foot, many defenders anticipate the zone he is directed to since he does lateral dribble before firing...

The reason why Boateng got knee breaked vs Messi he was anticipating a right dribble and a shot, because if you are alone and you don't coin flip it, you will only have to watch him finish it.

tiki is right again. stats demonstrate a great deal. but i mean, sunflash use your eyes and common sense as well.

And again, what does all that matter if he can't do anything useful? Missing a penalty is all he did in the end and lost again.

dude we get it. he missed a penalty. jesus. people miss penalties. what has he done for argentina? he brought through the group stages of the WC, he brought them to the finals of both copa america's. and argentina has the best win:lose ratio for 2 years. he literally gave them the chance to even playa final and go to penalties. useful? how about making argentina one of the most competitive teams in the world for the past 4 years. there can only be one winner, ONE. how about all the other teams that have never even made a final. some team's are legendary, they will always strive, that is why people trash talk them, because they can't get to that level. never forget the 1986 world cup in mexico.

Taking on players and getting marked is something that any player has to deal with, Lewandowski gets marked by several players for 90 minutes but still scores goals, now that's actually proving why he should be marked. If you tell me that Messi can't do anything because players mark him well thats an easy way to deal with a player.

and please tell me how many goals lewa has? not more than messi.

So he will be remembered for taking Argentina all the way to Copa America final and then being invisible and missing the first penalty and losing.

This game, is made for winners. Maradona was a winner. Messi as your best player has to repeat what Maradona did before he retires, no other way to look at his career, he has to bring the third star on the shirt.

Lewandowski has over 40 goals for Poland in 80 games, Messi has over 50 goals for Argentina in over 100 games.

he will be remembered as a legend of the game. even if he never wins an international trophy. everyone will look back and say he was one of the best players ever. also....you do realize that the south american qualifiers are harder than europe right. look at the teams poland faces. look at the teams argentina faces. realize something? yea, the team quality is different. also those over 50 goals messi has scored are for more important than any goal lewa has scored, excluding these qualifiers bc poland might actually make the world cup for once.

Put Lewandowski in Argentina and he will have the same stats 40 goals in 80 games, no doubt. Look at the players of Argentina and then at Poland, notice the bigger names are in Argentina. Marking a player is no excuse for him to be unable to perform, specially if he is the main star of the team.

MessI will be remembered but without World Cup glory, and coming from a big football nation like Argentina he will be missing that and Maradona will still be number one. That's part of life, Messi isn't from Wales so he can't say like Ryan Giggs that he was unable to win for his country.

im going to ignore your first sentence...because it's hypothetical and just a dumb argument. yea there are bigger names. there are bigger names in poland as well....their goalkeeper for one, is better than ours, schezny. zielinski, glik, blaszch....these are big name players. there was no excuses. we did perform, we made it to the finals. if you're saying argentina are bad, then every other team other than chile and germany and portugal are absolute trash bags. we lost that's it man. there's only one winner. i mean what is your point. maradona will always be better, he has 2 world cups and lost the 3rd one. pele is on the same level. i mean other than these 2 players. who has one their country more than one world cup solo. no one else.

So you are like Tiki you just ignore whatever doesn't fit in your opinion?
Pretty sure if Messi can score 3 goals vs Panama, Lewandowski can do it too, specially if he has someone like Di Maria to assist him, at least Lewandowski scored vs Germany and Portugal.

Everyone knows Poland is a weaker football team compared to Argentina but Lewandowski performs for his country as well as he can.

My whole point is that Messi not winning anything for his country has no excuse. You can't label him as the best player ever but then make excuses for him why he didn't win anyhing with Argentina.

It's easy to point out Barcelona, just like it's easy for Giggs to point out Manchester United but the difference is Giggs is from Wales and Messi is from Argentina which is a far bigger and better national team.

dude, not whatever doesn't fit my opinion, it's whatever is hypothetical. because you just sound dumb. uhh lemme just put this player here, and this player here and then he'd be as good as this player blah blah, it doesn't work like that. there are many amazing teams, i'm talking AMAZING. the dutch machine for example, back when those group of players were unbeatable, back when inter milan were unstoppable. they couldn't win any international trophy. yet everyone remembers them as amazing. same will happen with messi. Lewa is nothing to messi, he has never won a CL. he is a star of the moment, but a forgotten man of the future. people will remember the legends.

I've never seen 3 players marking Messi in a consistent manner all game, in the 50 or so games I've seen with him. Ever.

You lot are actually special. Messi's dribbling naturally brings him into loads of players, and because he's so good at it he'll naturally pull others. All of that is COMPLETELY FUCKING IRRELEVANT when his team doesn't have the ball. Marking means guarding OFF THE BALL. Messi does pull people off the ball, but never more than two - just like any other player to walk this stupid Earth.

If we're talking about Messi's team and their defensive ability - what happens when he has the ball is completely irrelevant to when they're defending. You don't see 3 defenders staying on the right side of the field trying to isolate Messi while their team is attacking - that would naturally make Messi's defense have an easier time. That's what I've been talking about this whole time. Jesus fucking christ.

How the actual fuck are you grown men who have watched this game your whole lives and don't understand what the word marking means? Fuck me. I know you lot are probably a bunch of strikers who've never defended in their lives, but still...