BlaugranaDude
5 years ago
Ronaldo will score around 850 goals.
Messi will score around 900 goals just because he's 2 and half years younger.
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BlaugranaDude
5 years ago
Ronaldo will score around 850 goals.
Messi will score around 900 goals just because he's 2 and half years younger.
tuan_jinn
5 years ago
LEGENDS!!!!
Again, I can't say enough of this, but the world wouldn't be the same, the day the 2 hang their boots... Don't even want to think about it
the_bald_genius
5 years ago
@tuan don't worry, even robben and ribery are still alive and speeding, pretty sure ronaldo and messi would last longer
Emobot7
5 years ago
@baldgenius Yeah, but I don't want their form to go down like Robben and Ribery has. :(
tuan_jinn
5 years ago
There was a suspicious guy claiming for sponsorship as Fifa federation bullshit...
Do not give any of your child details or anyone you know for such request. Look at the email, or the deeplink... They are often from free email provider or some scam, infected site.
Report them too, plz
tiki_taka
5 years ago
Wow didn’t thought Romario ratio was that high...
Dynastian98
5 years ago
Edited
@Tiki
He played a large part of his career in Brazil. His European record is not nearly as impressive.
More impressive is Puskas, who didn't play any football during his prime for a couple years because of the Hungarian Revolution, and still averaged almost a goal per game.
@Tiki
He played a large part of his career in Brazil. His European record is not nearly as impressive.
Marcus2011
5 years ago
If Ronaldo played all his life in La Liga he would have reached that number by now. Try scoring 30+ goals in EPL every year.
Dynastian98
5 years ago
@Marcus
So he can have outrageous goal tallies in the UCL, but not the EPL? Okay.
If Messi and Ronaldo played in the EPL with their Barca and Madrid teams, they would slap PL teams with the same consistency that they performed against La Liga and UCL teams. If you didn't know, Messi is one of the top scorers against PL top 6, and that's exclusively from the UCL.
Harry Kane can score 25-30 goals for several seasons in a row, Thierry Henry can do the same, but Ronaldo and Messi, who are objectively superior by several grades over those two players, will struggle to consistently hit 30+?
Marcus2011
5 years ago
Edited
If Real and Barca played in EPL then they wouldn’t have snatched our best players every season because they would have been under same financial bracket like every one else. That is a first factor.
Second factor, your CLs again were won by sheer invested money and lack of domestic competition were you barely give two shts because if one team has 6 point gap then title is his to take.
Third, your all EPL strikers who joined la Liga have been scoring even our shttty Torres and Morata improves suddenly. Not to speak of Llorente or Negredo or even Agüero was struggling until city built monster team for him to win too goal scorers scores trophy.
Fourth, our busy schedule won’t let Madrid and Barca field your second teams whenever you feel like.
Fifth, CL is prime competition but we have witnessed far too often have underdogs can take over stronger teams. So is that merit? Our best team in EPL is City and Liverpool, yet Tottenham is in the semi final.
Sixt, your greedy teams were one of the first ones to propose financial fair play because you felt threatened by new clubs getting investments. That is how crooked your teams are. Yet both clubs are fully in huge debts.
Seventh, you both clubs have referees in your pockets yet it isn’t funny how you accuse each other of cheating. Your both clubs are getting extreme favors in la Liga when things don’t go your way. In EPL that will happen a lot less although we have shttyb refs we still have some sort of balance among 6 teams.
It is easy to talk smack and beat your chest sitting on the high horse when you have financial muscle in la Liga, attracting young talents OFTEN UNETHICAL AND ILLEGAL WAYy, depriving your competitors off their star players surrounding your Messi and Ronaldo with prime players and then brag about how in la Liga it is hard to compete.
Man our teams smack any of the outside of top two in la Liga. Only one that can survive is Atletico bus which is fair game to them playing to their strengths because they don’t have luxury of buying players, because for years now you have been robbing them and other clubs from financial streams by creating advantageous contract deals with sponsors and broadcasters.
So yeah they will struggle to maintain 30+ playing for their respective teams like let’s say one plays for Liverpool and other For City. Every player who came to EPL said it is hard league to play in yet you la Liga fan boys still in reality distortion field.
If Real and Barca played in EPL then they wouldn’t have snatched our best players every season because they would have been under same financial bracket like every one else. That is a first factor.
Second factor, your CLs again were won by sheer invested money and lack of domestic competition were you barely give two shts because if one team has 6 point gap then title is his to take.
Third, your all EPL strikers who joined la Liga have been scoring even our shttty Torres and Morata improves suddenly. Not to speak of Llorente or Negredo or even Agüero was struggling until city built monster team for him to win too goal scorers scores trophy.
Fourth, our busy schedule won’t let Madrid and Barca field your second teams whenever you feel like.
Fifth, CL is prime competition but we have witnessed far too often have underdogs can take over stronger teams. So is that merit? Our best team in EPL is City and Liverpool, yet Tottenham is in the semi final.
Sixt, your greedy teams were one of the first ones to propose financial fair play because you felt threatened by new clubs getting investments. That is how crooked your teams are. Yet both clubs are fully in huge debts.
Seventh, you both clubs have referees in your pockets yet it isn’t funny how you accuse each other of cheating. Your both clubs are getting extreme favors in la Liga when things don’t go your way. In EPL that will happen a lot less although we have shttyb refs we still have some sort of balance among 6 teams.
It is easy to talk smack and beat your chest sitting on the high horse when you have financial muscle in la Liga, attracting young talents OFTEN UNETHICAL AND ILLEGAL WAYy, depriving your competitors off their star players surrounding your Messi and Ronaldo with prime players and then brag about how in la Liga it is hard to compete.
Man our teams smack any of the outside of top two in la Liga. Only one that can survive is Atletico bus which is fair game to them playing to their strengths because they don’t have luxury of buying players, because for years now you have been robbing them and other clubs from financial streams by creating advantageous contract deals with sponsors and broadcasters.
So yeah they will struggle to maintain 30+ playing for their respective teams like let’s one plays for Liverpool and other For City. Every player who came to EPL said it is hard league to play in yet you la Liga fan boys still in really distortion
mastashade
5 years ago
Edited
Marcus you should not list your argument it makes it easier to understand how irrelevant the points are to the conversation at hand. First off Dynastian was explaining CR7's goal-scoring rate between Man U and Real Madrid so your point about the financial construction of leagues is moot. It is also moot because your best teams take players from your worse teams all of the time, but yes over time it would be hard to be perennially among the top five in the world and often 1 and 2 as they with such rules. However that is hypothetical and we are speaking of what is.
Second, this lack of domestic competition argument is old and quite frankly absurd. Real, Barcelona, and Atletico are just able to perform at such a high level all of the time because how good they are from players to managers and so much else.There have been 6 different Premier league winners and during the same period La liga had 5 different winners. How big is that difference? My guess is big enough for Real Madrid or Barcelona to fit, meaning one of them probably would have crowded out one of those other winners.
Third, confirmation bias and lack of understanding paints your perception of strikers going between spain and england. You don't even back it up with stats. Lets look at Morata's stats.
Season Team Tourn - Apps - Mins - G A SpG KP Drb Fouled Off Disp UnsTch Rating
2018/2019 Atletico SLL, 12(2), 1011, 6, 1, 2, 0.3, 1.4, 1.3, ---- 0.9, 1.6, 2.2,---- 7.13
2018/2019 Chelsea EPL, 11(5), 943, 5, - , 2.2, 0.4, 0.4, 1,----- 1.3, 1.4, 1.8,---- 6.56
They look very comparable but the morata in Atletico has a better a rating. Its almost as if he is playing in a different system for a better coach for the second best team in spain versus the english third or fourth best team. The torres thing is a frequent false trope that epl fans love to tout, but this was caused by torres scoring big goals in big games when he came back but his quality and stats wasnt actually much changed. And you would think the switch from liverpool to chelsea would clue you in on the fact that systems matter and he fit the role better at Liverpool than Chelsea just like he did at Atletico as compared to Chelsea. Pedro seems to be doing fine. Costa was the man ATM then at Chelsea, but is now struggling at ATM. Systems and style matter. Show me more than a couple data points that have little to no change.
Fourth, I agree its is dumb that the English have so many cups. It is unsurprising though given the profit motive and teams wanting more chances to win titles. Also some of your teams tend to decide which competitions to care about so they do field second teams and barca doesnt always do that. Suarez and Messi and so many other key players on the barca squad have been barely rested under valverde or all the way back to enrique. Messi and the first team often play in the copa. they get rested in the second leg sometimes because they decide things in the first match or they rest in the first and try not to concede too many and try to drown them in goals at the camp nou which I am sure liverpool or united fans could see how that could happen to a team like everton or watford. This pain of unnecessary games has been inflicted upon yourselves so it is not an excuse.
Fifth it denotes a different type of merit. It shows a more discrete type of merit, whereas the league is more continuous because you have to consistently perform. So, while yes "could they do it consistently week in week out" is a question, but since we have data from a league that is of similar quality (la liga) and direct affirmation, through european competition, that these teams typically trounce their opponents and messi scores goals for fun against them then we can assume CR7 and messi would have scored similar numbers of goals in the epl. The argument that these guys get to rest is ridiculous. Barca and Real madrid often push each other to be perfect and this is only recent history and only due to a golden generation of Barca and a certain goat pushing it to that and Real responding to the challenge by building a monster of a team. Messi rarely gets to rest and he puts a world class performance in every facet as an attacking player nearly every game and Ronaldo possibly the greatest finisher of all time was the tip of the spear for a machine with world class bench players. Also over time yes we can compare because consistency can be assured over time because these guys have played so many games against THE BEST england has to offer. Imagine if we were taking data of these guys versus your mid and lower table teams.
Six, all clubs are greedy and its not a surprise when they argue for rules that help them. Clubs at the bottom are seen as hungry rather than greedy but the ones with the power need the restrictions the most in order to get competition so we see them as the antagonist, which is fair. Corruption follows power and lack of enforcement, but I think we are getting a bit far from messi and ronaldo cant score 30+ goals in the epl consistently. Though I will concede that Real and Barca may have a higher player turnover rate under different rules but this does nothing to refute the quality of either Real or Barca on the pitch and this is still a useless hypothetical.
Seventh refs make bad calls and Barca and Real Madrid both give the refs more chances to make calls for them than almost any other teams and they more often in the latter stages of the competition more often because of their quality, so its also more likely to happen for them at the highest stages in the current era of UCL. Confirmation bias. Volume does not equate to rate.
Eighth, you tried to sneak in a pot shot against our teams without any proof. "Man our teams smack any of the outside of top two in la Liga." Prove it. Wow trying to exclude the historical top two to make it seem equal and then giving a back-handed compliment, at best, to ATM to undercut how they are perceived. https://onsideview.com/football/la-liga/la-liga-is-the-best-league-in-the-world/
This is the first year in a while the epl has really competed with the la liga in both the UCL and UEL and credit to them and their MANAGERS. The managers have allowed the teams to create coherent styles and they have performed a lot better. In the future La liga is going to have be in trouble, Messi leaving Barca will probably make it Barca unstable at best. I also think that the epl revenue and market systems are more developed/better in the long run at least in terms of the league acquiring player talent. However they still have to put said talent together. Unai playing his old team is the most recent win of epl over la liga but that is a former manager and there is still a second leg. I agree they make the deals too advantageous for the top clubs, but they would take issue with "robbed" because their argument is people are watching for the best teams in the world with best players and they earned it by having the best results.
Ninth Ronaldo before his peak finishing ability in my eyes scored 31 goals for United in 2008. So yeah I think he could do it with Real more consistently and I definitely think messi can with a version of barca.
The final thing is barcelona has never competed anywhere near this level without the goat. Barca league titles before 2008 = 18 and now they have 8 more and messi has lead or been about second in goals, assists, and through balls in the top 5 leagues for much of that time. Same timeline for ucl titles 2008 = 2 and they have won 3 since. Messi would make almost any team competing for a league title almost unstoppable and any team in the champions league a competitor to win the whole thing. Now if every team in the epl just packed it in and booted it messi's numbers may have dropped from 50 in his peak to 40 something and his 7+ seasons 30+ goals to 4/5+ seasons. The years Real Madrid won the league while ronaldo was there they had great managers who put effort into the winning the league as well as great players, which is also a testament to the effectiveness of messi and barca's philosophy and other players (of which many of the greatest were homegorwn: messi, xavi, iniesta, busquets, pique) so again no need to buy when you make. So salty for someone who doesnt even watch la liga.
P.S. Dynastian's argument about If kane can do it or come close with spurs then they can do it is better than all of my arguments.
Marcus you should not list your argument it makes it easier to understand how irrelevant the points are to the conversation at hand. First off Dynastian was explaining CR7's goal-scoring rate between Man U and Real Madrid so your point about the financial construction of leagues is moot. It is also moot because your best teams take players from your worse teams all of the time, but yes over time it would be hard to be perennially among the top five in the world and often 1 and 2 as they with such rules. However that is hypothetical and we are speaking of what is.
Second, this lack of domestic competition argument is old and quite frankly absurd. Real, Barcelona, and Atletico are just able to perform at such a high level all of the time because how good they are from players and managers and so much else.There have been 6 different Premier league winners and during the same period La liga had 5 different winners. How big is that difference? My guess is big enough for Real Madrid or Barcelona to fit, meaning one of them probably would have crowded out one of those other winners.
Third, confirmation bias and lack of understanding paints your perception of strikers going between spain and england. You don't even back it up with stats. Lets look at Morata's stats.
Season Team Tourn - Apps - Mins - G A SpG KP Drb Fouled Off Disp UnsTch Rating
2018/2019 Atletico SLL, 12(2), 1011, 6, 1, 2, 0.3, 1.4, 1.3, ---- 0.9, 1.6, 2.2,---- 7.13
2018/2019 Chelsea EPL, 11(5), 943, 5, - , 2.2, 0.4, 0.4, 1,----- 1.3, 1.4, 1.8,---- 6.56
They look very comparable but the morata in Atletico has a better a rating. Its almost as if he is playing in a different system for a better coach for the second best team in spain versus the english third or fourth best team. The torres thing is a frequent false trope that epl fans love to tout, but this was caused by torres scoring big goals in big games when he came back but his quality and stats wasnt actually much changed. And you would think the switch from liverpool to chelsea would clue you in on the fact that systems matter and he fit the role better at Liverpool than Chelsea just like he did at Atletico as compared to Chelsea. Pedro seems to be doing fine. Costa was the man ATM then at Chelsea, but is now struggling at ATM. Systems and style matter. Show me more than a couple data points that have little to no change.
Fourth, I agree its is dumb that the English have so many cups. It is unsurprising though given the profit motive and teams wanting more chances to win titles. Also some of your teams tend to decide which competitions to care about so they do field second teams and barca doesnt always do that. Suarez and Messi and so many other key players on the barca squad have been barely rested under valverde or all the way back to enrique. Messi and the first team often play in the copa. they get rested in the second leg sometimes because they decide things in the first match or they rest in the first and try not to concede too many and try to drown them in goals the camp nou which I am sure liverpool or united fans could see how that could happen to a team like everton or watford. This pain of unnecessary games has been inflicted upon yourselves so it is not an excuse.
Fifth it denotes a different type of merit. It shows a more discrete type of merit, whereas the league is more continuous because you have to consistently perform. So, while yes could they do it consistently week in week out is a question, but since we have data from a league that is of similar quality (la liga) and direct affirmation, through european competition, that these teams typically trounce their opponents and messi scores goals for fun against them we can assume CR7 and messi would have scored similar numbers of goals in the epl. The argument that these guys get to rest is ridiculous. Barca and Real madrid often push each other to be perfect and this is only recent history and only due to a golden generation of Barca and a certain goat pushing it to that and Real responding to the challenge by building a monster of a team. Messi rarely gets to rest and he puts a world class performance in every facet as an attacking player nearly every game and Ronaldo possibly the greatest finisher of all time was the tip of the spear for a machine with world class bench players. Also over time yes we can compare because there is consistency can be assured over time because these guys have played many games against THE BEST england has to offer. Imagine if we were taking data of these guys versus your mid and lower table teams.
Six, all clubs are greedy and its not a surprise when they argue for rules that help them. Clubs at the bottom are seen as hungry rather than greedy but the ones with the power need the restrictions the most in order to get competition so we see them as the antagonist, which is fair. Corruption follows power and lack of enforcement, but I think we are getting a bit far from messi and ronaldo cant score 30+ goals in the epl consistently. Though I will concede that Real and Barca may have a higher player turnover rate under different rules but this does nothing to refute the quality of either Real or Barca on the pitch and this is still a useless hypothetical.
Seventh refs make bad calls and Barca and Real Madrid both give the refs more chances than almost any other teams and they more often in the latter stages of the competition because of their quality, so its also more likely to happen for them at the highest stages in the current era of UCL. Confirmation bias. Volume does not equate to rate.
Eighth, you tried to sneak in a pot shot against our teams without any proof. "Man our teams smack any of the outside of top two in la Liga." Prove it. Wow trying to exclude the historical top two to make it seem equal and then giving a back-handed compliment, at best, to ATM to undercut they are perceived. https://onsideview.com/football/la-liga/la-liga-is-the-best-league-in-the-world/
This is first year in a while the epl has really competed with the la liga in both the UCL and UEL and credit to them and their MANAGERS. The managers have allowed the teams to create coherent styles and they have performed a lot better. In the future La liga is going to have be in trouble, Messi leaving Barca will probably make it Barca unstable at best. Unai playing his old team is the most recent win of epl over la liga but that is a former manager and there is still a second leg. I agree they make the deals to advantageous for the top clubs, but they would take issue with "robbed" because their argument is people are watching for the best teams in the world with best players and they earned it by having the best results.
Ninth Ronaldo before his peak finishing ability in my eyes scored 31 goals for United in 2008. So yeah I think he could do it with Real more consistently and I definitely think messi can with a version of barca.
The final thing is barcelona has never competed anywhere near this level without the goat. Barca league titles before 2008 = 18 and now they have 8 more and messi has lead or been about second in goals, assists, and through balls in the top 5 leagues for much of that time. Same timeline for ucl titles 2008 = 2 and they have won 3 since. Messi would make almost any team competing for a league title almost unstoppable and any team in the champions league a competitor to win the whole thing. Now if every team in the epl just packed it in and booted it messi's numbers may have dropped from 50 in his peak to 40 something and his 7+ seasons 30+ goals to 4/5+ seasons. The years Real Madrid won the league while ronaldo was there they had great managers who put effort into the winning the league as well as great players, which is also a testament to the effectiveness of messi and barca's philosophy and other players (of which many of the greatest were homegorwn: messi, xavi, iniesta, busquets, pique) so again no need to buy when you make. So salty for someone who doesnt even watch la liga.
P.S. Dynastian's argument about If kane can do it or come close with spurs then they can do it is better than all of my arguments.
Greatone
5 years ago
i honestly love how easy it is for us football fans to cherry pick data, so it's good to see some logic flying around
the_bald_genius
5 years ago
If la liga top 4 played in epl, arsenal manutd and chelsea would be a midtable team
Lodatz
5 years ago
If la liga top 4 played in epl, arsenal manutd and chelsea would be a midtable team
If La Liga Top 4 played in the PL, Barcelona would be 3rd, Atletico would be 8th, and everyone else would be scrapping for 14th.
Marcus2011
5 years ago
I am too lazy to respond with lot of research and argument. I barely find time to write comment here but kudos to you.
It don’t matter how much argue over this point though, it won’t get through your thick heads because I have been saying same thing since forever. I will just let the forces of markets to even out the playing field, as it is already happening. And let EPL and media do the talking. Just sit back and enjoy, it will be a long ride 😉
Emobot7
5 years ago
Personally, I love debate and stuff like that but hate it when people bring a what if argument cause those thing cannot be backed by stat. Its sad but you cannot compare team playing in different league, not even with the results in CL or Europa league. Not imo anyway. There is just too many thing to take into consideration.
Marcus2011
5 years ago
Edited
@emo exactly good point
“What if” often doesn’t considers many other factors. I only stated that Ronaldo has significantly more goals in la Liga and he stayed much more healthier there playing almost every match. Where in EPL he would suffer from injuries and most goals he has scored were in 2008- once. Therefore, only logical to assume that he would have scored more goals had he started his career in Madrid’s academy or Barcelona’s then make his way into the team.
@emo exactly good point
“What if” often doesn’t considers many other factors. I only stated that Ronaldo has significantly more goals in la Liga and he stayed much more healthier there playing almost every match. Where in EPL he would suffer from injuries and most goals he has scored were in 2008- once.
tiki_taka
5 years ago
Edited
After 5 straight liga win in CL, one PL win since 2012 and old shit is reappearing...
And then it’s me the biased lol, if PL clubs were dominating CL for that long I think Lodatz and Marcus would claim Madrid and Barcelona playing relegation battle in England...
England has 2 real big teams since SAF United of 2011, while Europe this season are in rebuilding in Bayern and Madrid, let’s see if the mighty English clubs these retards are pushing will be dominating for a decade.
Atletico over this decade got more CL results than any PL team, that’s a consistency fact, 2 finals lost agaisnt Madrid, 5 Semifinals, countless quarters...
Yet they would be midtable club in England, fine analysis by Lodatz the reappearing ghost....
Welcome back, genius.
After 5 straight liga win in CL, one PL win since 2012 and old shit is reappearing...
And then it’s me the biased lol, if PL clubs were dominating CL for that long I think Lodatz and Marcus would claim Madrid and Barcelona playing relegation battle in England...
England has 2 real big teams since SAF United of 2011, while Europe this season are in rebuilding in Bayern and Madrid, let’s see if the mighty English clubs these retards are pushing will be dominating for a decade.
tiki_taka
5 years ago
Edited
For the goals scored âge has the most of it, Messi at his start was scoring barely 20 goals a season and so Ronaldo. To Arrive at Madrid with Kaka Benzema and Mou, club of galactics, many players would score many goals with that pressure to achieve, that teammates and that competition...
The retarded one player argument can be destroyed by many players, Aguero never scored that much in la liga, nor Torres.....
BECAUSE THEY REACHED THEIR PEAK IN ENGLAND NOT THAT THE SPANISH LEAGIE WAS HARDER. Stupidity level 99
If Liverpool and City reached these amounts of points it’s because one is pushing the other.
It was the case in Spain from 2008 to know, while retards were screaming 2 horses league.
See now the impact of having great competition domestically ? Instead of top 6 of poneys bottling it week in week out ?
For the goals scored âge has the most of it, Messi at his start was scoring barely 20 goals a season and so Ronaldo. To Arrive at Madrid with Kaka Benzema and Mou, club of galactics, many players would score many goals with that pressure to achieve, that teammates and that competition...
If Liverpool and City reached these amounts of points it’s because one is pushing the other.
It was the case in Spain from 2008 to know, while retards were screaming 2 horses league.
See now the impact of having great competition domestically ? Instead of top 6 of poneys bottling it week in week out ?
tiki_taka
5 years ago
This season the best league was PL, most points, most complicated to win, most consistent leaders...
And CL results is only a mirror of this incredible season.
That’s my point for a decade now.
In their previous games, Messi and Ronaldo simultaneously reached their 600th club goals! Ronaldo's goal vs. Inter was his 600th, and Messi's second goal vs. Liverpool was his 600th as well.
Here is the current list of men's footballers (according to Wikipedia) who have 600+ goals. This includes international and professional youth teams, so the numbers are higher for Messi and Ronaldo.
Ronaldo is 103 goals away from breaking Bican's record and is aged 34.
Messi is 114 goals away from breaking Bican's record and is soon to be aged 32.
How many goals do you think either will finish with?